A bill to ease Californians’ access to balcony solar, also called plug-in PV, just cleared the state Legislature and is now sitting on Gov. Gavin Newsom's desk. If he signs the bill, SB 868, California could become the tenth state to legalize this simple technology: a solar panel that plugs straight into a wall outlet and be fixed to a home’s balcony, no permits or rooftop installation required.
In today's episode, Ken sits down with EWG's own Bernadette Del Chiaro, senior vice president for California. She's a longtime clean energy advocate who has spent decades fighting for consumer access to solar, from early rooftop solar policy battles to today's fight for balcony solar.
Their conversation traces how the idea made its way from Germany to Utah and now to California, why the state’s three major investor-owned utilities fought it every step of the way, and why this could be one of the biggest wins yet for everyday consumers in the fight for affordable, distributed clean energy.
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Ken Cook: Hey there, it's Ken Cook, and I'm having another episode. This one's really fun because we're on the verge of doing something pretty exciting in California and a bunch of other states too, as it happens, New York, for example. I'm talking about a bill that's sitting on Governor Newsom's desk right now, SB 868, California's balcony solar bill, also known as plug-in PV. It's a simple idea.
Give everyday Californians, renters, and condo owners included, a simple way to plug a solar panel in directly to an outlet and start generating their own power. Not a rooftop array, not anything fancy involving utilities that require permits and so forth, just more like an appliance, like a toaster or a refrigerator, except this one gives you back energy by capturing it in the solar panels and sending it directly into your home. Nine states have already legalized it.
California could be the tenth, but New York, I hope, might beat California. Let's see. Governor Hochul has a bill rather like it on her desk too. But the governor of California only has about a couple of weeks left to sign it before the bill is no longer valid, even though it's been passed by the Assembly and the Senate.
My guest today is my colleague Bernadette Del Chiaro, EWG's senior vice president for California, who's been at the center of this effort from the start, really. She's been at the center of rooftop solar, not just in California, but globally. She's really one of the leading experts on distributed electricity generation.
We're gonna talk about how balcony solar made its way from Germany to a small-town legislator in Utah, of all places, to Sacramento now, and why utilities have fought it every step of the way and why this is exactly the kind of common sense energy policy we need more of. How about affordability? Plug this baby in and suddenly you're air-conditioned for the whole summer for free. These are the simple steps we need to take to bring people into the green energy revolution.
Bernadette, I'm tickled you're here. Tell me a little bit about how this whole balcony solar movement got started and how and when you heard about it. EWG brought it to California. We found a bill sponsor. Because it's very exciting when we haven't had a lot of wins when it comes to distributed energy, consumer-owned energy. It's nice to have this come along and, you know- Literally a ray of hope. So welcome again. How did all this come about?
Bernadette Del Chiaro: Thank you. It's so great to be here. Yeah, it really is an exciting time. It's like we're having a little rebirth of people realizing that this technology that where we can turn just everyday sunlight into usable electrons is kind of miraculous, and it's amazing, and it's right there at our fingertips, and it's available now. It's not something in the future. It's been really, really fun to be able to advocate for this new version and possibly the simplest version of solar.
The history of it is really fascinating, I think. The idea of attaching a solar panel, the same ones that you see on people's roofs, you know, millions, over two million roofs across California have this technology. It's the exact same technology, and the only difference is it's attached to a cord, and that cord is just a regular plug and it plugs into a regular outlet. That's the only difference, and that actually is nothing new.
Do it yourselfers, you know, solar off-gridders and other folks have been- Yeah ... messing around with this technology for decades. What is new is sort of the professionalization of it and the ability to go buy a kit at your local hardware store. That's what's new, and it actually sprung up out of the necessity of getting out from underneath oppressive electricity costs in Germany.
Now Germany- Uh-huh ... after the Ukraine war broke out saw their gas prices go through the roof and their electricity prices followed suit. And so people started looking for whatever they could do to get out from underneath that. Sound familiar, California- Yeah ... and, and a lot of other places?
And so industry that is pretty strong in Germany 'cause they have a very strong support for rooftop solar- Said, "Hey, let's modify it, let's put a cord on the end, and let's make it available to more people," in particular renters and condo dwellers and folks that don't have- Yeah maybe as much control or access to their roofs. And so they have installed over four million of these plug-in or balcony solar systems in just four years.
So they've really taken the technology and, and taken it by storm. Interestingly, there was a New York Times article about that movement, and a little-known legislator out of Utah, his name is Raymond Ward, he's a pediatrician by day. Utah has a very, very part-time legislature. Yeah. He's Republican, notably as is most of the legislature in Utah. He read that article and said, "We should bring that to Utah. That's-" Yeah ...
"seems like a good idea." And so he single-handedly wrote a law, worked with the utility there that at first was resistant but then, you know, he won them over. He got all of his colleagues in Utah to go for it, and they unanimously passed the first balcony solar bill in the country that legalizes it and makes it basically accessible to consumers.
And after hearing about that story, I got so excited- Yeah ... that I went to one of our, you know, local state senators, Scott Wiener, out of San Francisco, longtime champion for consumers and for consumer solutions like solar, and pitched him on the idea and he said yes, and so we were the, actually the second state to officially introduce legislation following Utah.
Ken Cook: Yeah.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: But that's the history, and now we'll be the 10th state if Governor Newsom signs the bill to legalize balcony solar.
Ken Cook: So say a little bit about how the debate went back and forth over this. To me, I just can't think of something that would be more of a no-brainer to support, Republican and Democrat alike. And in the legislature there was immediate bipartisan support, right? But we did have a few, a few people who were taking potshots. What was their take on it, and what was the nature of the opposition? We overcame it, but-
Bernadette Del Chiaro: Yeah, yeah ...
Ken Cook: say a little bit about that, 'cause it's, I think it reveals so much about what's wrong with the way energy politics, electricity politics are going in this country broadly.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: That's right. I mean, first off, just to elaborate, I haven't- Been able to talk to legislators and legislator staff about solar energy in a way that has been so positive and warm and welcoming in a really long time. In almost every office we would walk into to introduce the bill and introduce the idea of balcony solar, where their reaction wasn't, "Of course you have my vote, I really wanna know how can I get myself one of these?"
Ken Cook: Right. Yeah,
Bernadette Del Chiaro: yeah,
Ken Cook: yeah.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: It was everybody is excited, and this was across the political spectrum. And the votes eventually reflect that, near unanimous votes in support of the bill. However, opposition was quite fierce, and it's really narrowed down to the utilities, and specifically PG&E kinda took the lead in opposition to SB 868, and to this day they remain opposed to it. Their arguments really changed and evolved over time. At one point, interestingly, PG&E was support if amended, but then their amendments would've gutted the bill.
But then they just- ... flipped and said, "Ah, forget it, we're just opposed." Their arguments really did not hold water, and I think most legislators saw right through it, and that's why we got such strong votes, 'cause they really are powerful and persuasive.
Primarily they tried to argue safety, and what their argument is is essentially this is an electrical device, and in theory might interact a tiny bit with our poles and wires, and so anything that is elect- in the world of electronics, you know, we wanna control. And so you need to go through- Yeah ... our approval process so that we can make sure it's safe, 'cause we are the, you know, the protectors of grid safety.
Ken Cook: That's how they wake up every morning. Yeah. I mean, unless there's a massive wildfire that their equipment has started, they do sometimes wake up to that safety issue here in California.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: Or a major substation in San Francisco that causes the lights to go out for 10 days straight. Yeah. I mean, they don't have a good track record when it comes to safety, but nonetheless they use it as an argument to keep solutions out of the hands of consumers. And so they did manage to slow us down. They put in some amendments to the bill, but at the end of the day they could not stop us.
They can't stop this technology from reaching consumers. It's just too good, and there's too much support for it. So we, hopefully if the governor again signs it, doesn't fall prey to their arguments, we'll be on our way- Yeah to having these in the aisle of Home Depot in a short period of time.
Ken Cook: Yeah. So could I go to Home Depot now and just, or someplace else, and just buy one of these systems and- plug it in even though it's not officially approved. I kept wondering if one of the issues wasn't, hey, you know, people might just start doing this on their own. Why don't we, why don't we set it up with some guardrails and some regulatory framework? But can I just go and do this now?
Bernadette Del Chiaro: Yeah, I mean, actually, that was one of our main arguments. We actually argued that this bill was a safety bill, and that without it, people are able to just go do- Yeah ... do the stuff themselves.
And what this bill's gonna do is bring the technology to the fore and apply safety standards, uniform safety standards, and make sure that it is safe for anybody to walk into any Home Depot or any Ikea or on Amazon-type platform and purchase a safe system that's easy and safe to plug in anywhere. The answer to your question is yes. In fact, there are some Bay Area-based startup companies that you could go buy a plug-in system today.
One is called Brightsaver based in Oakland. Mm-hmm. Wonderful company. You would be plugging in under a regulatory kinda gray area where technically you might need to get your utility's permission to do that legally, and there are some legitimate safety issues that I think- Yeah future versions of this technology are going to address. But you could technically do it right now.
And what we really wanna see, though, is not only these systems becoming simpler and safer for everybody to use, whether you're a solar enthusiast and or not, but also we wanna see the cost come down, and this is why- Yeah getting California into the market is so important.
The size of our market and the size of- Yeah ... the demand will help- More companies get into the game, increase production, and lower prices, and so we should see costs come down to make these really affordable to everybody.
Ken Cook: Say a little bit about what these systems are capable of doing. I just have this image in my mind of someone who rents a home in the Central Valley where the temperatures fairly commonly are in the high 90s or over 100 degrees, and you can't survive without some form of cooling. And you could offset air conditioning costs, which would be a big deal for people who are paying very high prices for electricity.
Here in California, we're... what are we, number two, right below Hawaii in the cost of electricity?
Bernadette Del Chiaro: That's right. The rates are so funny, and they're so all over the map. I think in some ti- in some ways you look at it, we're number one, but either way, it's astronomically expensive to plug in and run an air conditioner. And you're right, California spends $4 billion a year just to cool our homes and our apartments. That's out of our own pockets, just as residents living in California, whether you're a renter or homeowner, we collectively spend $4 billion.
And all of that could be covered, it could be wiped off our annual budgets if we all had some form of solar, whether it was rooftop or balcony- Yeah or plug-in. We could cover that load 100%. Even the smallest balcony solar system that's lightweight. Yeah.
The smallest ones right now available are about two feet by three feet, to give you a sense, and they're, they're light, they're less than two pounds, and you can literally zip tie them to your balcony railing right now. Those will cover and offset the electricity usage of a window air conditioning unit. So just completely wipe out- Yeah ... the expense of that over the course of a year.
Amazingly, 58% of California rate payers are currently in arrears with a utility company, meaning they are behind payments.
Ken Cook: Say that number again.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: 58% of California families have fallen behind in their ability to pay their utility bill, which means when it gets hot- And it's getting hotter, right? We just released a report showing that the data is showing that it's not just in our imagination. California really is getting hotter, and not only is it getting hotter, but the heat is getting more extreme, which puts and creates a serious public health threat. Yeah.
One of the reasons why EWG- Yeah ... cares about energy as an issue. So makes having access to air conditioning, but also the ability to afford to run that air conditioner- Yeah ... a very, very serious public health situation. And, you know, credit to Josh Wink.
Josh Wink is a- Yeah ... student, graduate student at UC Berkeley, Goldman School of Public Policy, worked with us over the summer as an energy fellow and did a great job helping us dig up all of this really good data about both extreme heat and how it's on the rise in California. 'Cause I mean, we all know California's a hot state. Yeah.
You know, on the one hand you go, "Okay, why is that news?" But it's not only are we seeing more days that are hot- Mm-hmm ... but they're hotter, so they're more- Yeah ... extreme. So we're seeing a 55% increase in the number of days that are extremely hot, a level of heat that threatens public health for everybody, including sensitive populations. We're seeing a 55% increase, and that's on average. Some regions are seeing a steeper increase.
So interestingly, San Francisco, for example- Yeah ... has seen 145% increase in the number of extremely hot days. Now, that still is not a large number compared to, say, San Bernardino, but San Francisco is also the least equipped to handle extreme heat.
Ken Cook: Yeah.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: And again, just to touch upon this, a lot of us, again, take heat for granted. We think it's an inconvenience. Maybe we can't go for an outdoor run when we want to, or our kids have to take more water breaks during their soccer game. But it's actually a very serious public health risk. Yeah.
When our bodies try to shed excess heat, it puts a lot of stress on our organs, particularly our heart and our lungs and our kidneys, and that actually can cause problems for all of us if we don't have access to cooling or water.
But it's especially a problem for large segments of our population, you know, pregnant women, young children, infants, the elderly, and people with preexisting health issues, and it makes actually access to cooling a critical public health need, and we need it in our homes. 13% of Californians work for home, and a huge uncounted number of people are just at home for whatever reason. Yeah. They're retired, they have disability, they have children, whatever it is. So having access to cooling is really important.
And places like San Francisco, part of our data that we reveal in this report is new US census data that counts how many air conditioning units are in California. And a shockingly low number in places like San Francisco and all along the central and northern California coast, the accessibility to air conditioning is down to just 35% of homes. Yeah.
So the vast majority of people in these regions do not have access to air conditioning, which means the uptick in extreme heat is a real widespread problem.
Ken Cook: Oh, no question. We live just north of San Francisco, and I think most of our neighbors did not have, and we didn't have, central air conditioning. We had it finally put in just last year But we have solar on our rooftop, and duck curves be damned. The sun is shining exactly when we need- That's
Bernadette Del Chiaro: right ...
Ken Cook: the air conditioning. Funny thing about that. And it goes along with the rest of climate change's observable impacts, longer dry season, longer fire season, the higher temperatures for more days, as you said. And what does the potential look like at the state level in terms of the number of units that could fly out of Home Depot or Costco and, and end up saving somebody a lot of money? And we should mention this is something you can take with you.
This is a system if you're renting and you're gonna be in three rental units over the next 10 or 15 years, which is not so unusual for people to move around. As long as the situation is conducive to hanging solar panels on your balcony or propping them up in the backyard somehow, this is, um, an appliance basically you can take with you. What are people thinking the potential is here in the California market? It must be huge.
Do I need to get stock in one of- is that-
Bernadette Del Chiaro: They're, they're so small at this point, I'm not sure they have stock options,
Ken Cook: but- Yeah, they probably don't. Yeah.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: No, the California potential is huge. I mean, it's bigger than Germany, right? So if Germany has built a market of four million of these systems over four gigawatts to just about two Diablo Canyons worth of plug-in solar in just four short years, it gives you a sense- Wow of what the potential is in- Wow ... much sunnier and much... I mean, our electricity prices are among the highest in the world, so we don't need a Ukraine war.
We have other problems- Yeah ... that are driving our prices, and we can spend another whole episode on that. But- Yeah ... yeah, I think the potential is, is huge. To give people a sense of these, right now the lowest price for the smallest system that pretty much will cover, like, your refrigerator and a modem and a few lights, that costs around only $250 right now.
Ken Cook: Oh, wow.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: Yeah, so the prices can be pretty low on, on just sh- give you a sense of, like, the entry point.
Ken Cook: Yeah.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: And then they go all the way up to $2,500 if you're buying a bigger system and you're adding a battery, just to give you a sense. But, you know, the technology itself, the photovoltaic panel, the glass or plastic-covered panel that turns sunlight into electricity, the inverter that converts it from direct current to alternating current that your home can use, and then the simple cord that plugs it into a wall outlet, that's really not expensive technology.
What we tend to spend a lot of money on here in California is all the soft costs, all the permitting, getting the- Yes ... utilities' permission, and then obviously labor and all of those soft costs that go in that really balloon up the cost of solar. So the beauty of this is you kinda cut all of that out. You just do it yourself. These really are way simpler than anything you could buy at Ikea that requires any setup. Yeah.
I've, I've done these myself. They're really quite easy. And then as you say, they're yours and they're portable. And then again, they're modular, so if you only have a small balcony, you can buy a small system. It's still going to save you money. The minute you plug it in, the way it works is it immediately sends juice backwards through the wires in your home Electricity doesn't have a direction. Just like water in a pipe, it doesn't care.
It just goes to wherever there's the lowest pressure, right?
Ken Cook: Mm-hmm, yep.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: So when you have a device plugged in, the minute the sun hits that panel and you plug it into a regular wall outlet, the electrons move backwards through the wall, and they immediately start powering that device of yours, and in so doing, lower the amount of electricity you're using or buying from your local utility, whatever local utility that is. It doesn't matter. Right. Yeah. So you immediately reduce your use of grid-supplied electricity, and you save money.
And so you just need a small patch of sunlight. You know, the more you have, the better. The better the orientation, right? If you have a south-facing balcony or deck, if you can orient it and there's no shading, all of those same things that people that go solar have to think about apply to balcony. Of course. But you'd be surprised how a small patch, you know, a small patch of sun can really make a difference.
Ken Cook: That is so amazing. So we've got 20 days, you say, before we'll know. Maybe he'll sign it sooner. We'll just have to see.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: Yeah, and, uh, you know, we mentioned the history. There are nine other states so far this year that introduced legislation after California introduced ours, but their legislative sessions are much shorter, so they got to the finish line sooner, which is terrific. And these range from Maryland, Virginia, Maine, New York, New Jersey, Colorado.
I mean, there's a lot of states that have jumped on this balcony solar bandwagon and have adopted legislation almost identical to SB 868, the Senator Wiener bill here in California. The only two states that are left pending are New York and California, so a bill is on Governor Hochul's desk in New York- Yeah and a bill is on Governor Newsom's desk here in California. We are very hopeful that the governor will sign it.
We don't have any indication that his office has any concerns with the bill. Like I said, the opposition has really been narrowed down to just a handful of utility companies, and their arguments really kind of don't hold up because this bill is really a safety bill, not to mention an energy affordability and a climate solutions bill as well.
Ken Cook: Yeah, a kitchen table bill, literally.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: That's right.
Ken Cook: Let's do something about affordability that's tangible, and this is it. And then there are a whole bunch of other states where the idea is still percolating, right? It might be in legislation that's been introduced, but it hasn't made it through to the governor yet. So another dozen or so, if I remember correctly? Easy. Yes. Yeah. Easily
Bernadette Del Chiaro: another dozen, and I know- Yeah ... there's many that are Actively gearing up and getting ready either for the remainder of this year or for next year. We've been in touch with folks in Illinois and North Carolina and Oregon. Even an organization in Toronto wants to start legalizing this in Canada.
So it is taking off like, I don't wanna say wildfire when we're talking about electricity, but- No, no ... nonetheless, it is taking off, and everybody, you know, wants to get in because it is, as you say, such a no-brainer.
And, you know, there are politicians all over the country wringing their hands, worrying about how to address energy affordability, and this is- Hmm the most concrete and real and tangible and accessible way that you can bring legitimate energy affordability, not just, "Okay, I'm gonna keep the problem from getting worse". Yeah, yeah. But I'm gonna put money in your pocket, right? You can save anywhere from 100 bucks to over $800 a year with one of these low-priced, easy-to-install systems.
So it's, it's real savings.
Ken Cook: It's amazing, and the, the idea of embracing this for your family and your home, whether you rent or own, it doesn't really matter, but to be part of the green energy, clean energy revolution is exciting. I still have sort of a giddiness about me when I look up at my solar panels, which need to be hosed off, in fairness.
But I think that participatory populist opportunity is super important to building momentum for, you know, taking clean energy to the next level because that next level's in- almost inevitably going to involve some, some tussle with the powers that be, utilities, and maybe s- some of the unions that, uh, work for the utilities or work with the utilities. So I think it builds that civic muscle, too, huh?
Bernadette Del Chiaro: No, that's, that's absolutely right. I think there's something actually really exciting and, and uplifting about the amount of- Support for this one particular solution of solar energy, whatever form it comes in.
Ken Cook: Yeah.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: And it is absolutely that we can do it, we can do it together, and every little action counts. You know, the sense of I get to be part of something- Yeah ... bigger than myself, but also get to just solve problems myself. I mean, there's just some powerful- Yeah ... kinda human motivators there. I think it's really important to point out that this technology we have invented, it's actually a California invention.
I say this all the time, but it's just something I- Mm ... I'm, I'm really proud of as a Californian, that we invented this idea of turning this photovoltaic material into an energy resource, and we basically brought it to market. Other countries then went and improved upon it, and then it's come back to us. Obviously, uh, of- oftentimes it's a California-Germany ping pong game, funny enough.
But we created this, and it isn't a technological problem that it isn't right now accessible to everybody.
Ken Cook: Yeah.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: It's not a technical problem. It is 100% a policy problem- Yeah ... and that is a political problem. So we could have it on every apartment. We could have these on every balcony. It could cover vertical as well as rooftop space, and we could power our entire state this way. Yeah.
It's not a matter of we don't have enough sunshine, it's not a matter of we don't have enough built environment to work with, and it's definitely not a matter of we don't have, you know, the ability to smooth out demand with generation and all that mumbo jumbo. We have the technology. It's just a matter of policy. And so we have worked for a very long time to try to get rid of the split incentive for apartments.
The split incentive being that the landlord owns the building, owns the roof, controls that built environment, and the tenant pays the utility bill So there's this misalignment in the solar incentive, the incentive for people to go solar. And so balcony leapfrogs over that, right? Yeah, yeah.
Because you don't need your building permission, and in fact, California, I should mention this, has a law since 1978 called the Solar Rights Act that protects the rights of Californians to have access to solar on their property where they live, where they, where they are. It doesn't apply specifically to rooftop. So we have the law on our side, and you have access to sunlight.
There's only that, that split incentive of the landlord and the tenant that is keeping solar from being in the hands and of every renter that, you know, that has access to sun, and that really could be solved much more efficiently and much more quickly with good public policy. Yeah. Of course, we've been clawing those policies back. We have- Yeah ... obliterated the most powerful policy that's been driving solar for renters called virtual net metering, but balcony, again, leapfrogs over it.
So I'm, I'm hopeful that not only we'll get solar energy in the hands of more people, we will open the door to more types of families and consumers being able to really experience the joy that you talk about, Ken, of just how much fun it is to- It is to make energy from the sun. Like, it really is-
Ken Cook: Yeah ...
Bernadette Del Chiaro: the
Ken Cook: greatest thing. Totally fun. The other fun thing is to drive around with my wife and point to rooftops and tell her that that would be a good spot for solar. "It's a shame, honey. Honey, honey, look at that warehouse. No, no, d- look at that. Look at that one." And she's like, "Yes, dear." You don't have to talk about climate change in terms of- Right ... polar bears, which I want the record to show we support polar bears.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: Yeah.
Ken Cook: You can talk about it as something that's imminent and part of your everyday life where you're contributing to not only your own financial bottom line but to cleaner air and fewer carbon dioxide emissions and all the rest. I think that's partly why it's- considered so dangerous by the utilities. It's that infectiousness about it too, right?
Bernadette Del Chiaro: Oh, yeah. I mean, because it has no limit, it virtually has no technological limit, and because it cuts them out completely, they really are pulling out all the stops to try to blockade consumer access to solar in all forms. You know, this issue of rooftop solar, this, this policy of net metering has been much maligned that the utilities hired a fancy PR firm at the national level.
They all got together a few years ago and hired a very fancy PR firm to go, "How do we really... We really need to put a nail in the coffin of rooftop solar. How do we do it?" And they invented this whole concept called the cost shift, and they literally have a PowerPoint that has been exposed detailing how they were going to pitch and sell this idea of the cost shift to Americand it has worked.
I mean, we have seen- Yeah ... our uptake- Yeah ... of solar energy in California decimate and not return right now, um, in the state because of bad public policy decisions. And again, that only keeps it out of the hands of everyone, right? Yeah. It was a working- and middle-class energy solution.
A lot of people don't know this, but 60, over 60% of the rooftop solar going up in California was going up on working-class and middle-class homes- Yeah ... and apartment buildings. It wasn't just for the rich- Yeah as people like to think. And so we can solve all of these problems. You also mentioned the duck curve earlier.
I don't know how many of your listeners know even what that is, but there's this amazing misunderstanding right now in Californiand it's a misunderstanding that's being perpetuated by the utilities and their allies. If you ask anybody that has any kind of small amount of knowledge or pays attention to energy issues, which is not a lot of people, but you know, those that do, if you ask them, "When does California use the most amount of electricity? What time of day?
When does our electricity usage peak?" I guarantee you almost everybody that's, again, in kind of like the energy environment world paying attention to all this mumbo jumbo, they will tell you, "I think probably around 6:00 in the evening when we all get home." And they think that's logical, 'cause when I'm at work, I'm not running my air conditioner, but I get home and I'm running my air conditioner. I may have a new induction stove 'cause I'm a good environmentalist.
I plugged in my EV and it's charging up. Yeah. Whatever it is- Mm-hmm ... I'm home, I'm running my washer, my dishwasher, I'm using electricity, so that must be California's peak. But that's not. California's electricity usage peaks around 2:00, 2:30 in the afternoon. And that's because we use it in our offices- Yeah ... and in our businesses, and our air conditioners are blasting away at that point in time.
We're using the most electricity to drive our economy, and our economy is being driven in the middle of the day, which is why weekends are never peak usage. Like, we're all at home all day long on the weekends, right? Yeah, yeah. And yet our electricity use doesn't peak. So it is definitely in the middle of the day. And the reason why that's so important, not to belabor this point, but that's when solar works best. Yeah.
And yet there is this perception that's being pushed by the utilities that solar, especially rooftop solar, is useless. Its value is negative value to California because it doesn't generate electricity when we need it.
Ken Cook: We generate too much of it when we can't use it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: And we don't even need it at that, and it's not true. Yeah. So there's so much reeducation, and what beautiful again about balcony or plugin, whatever you wanna call it, is that it gets at this idea of people can use it for themselves on site. It's not about exporting, it's not about all this other stuff. It's just on site covering your own usage and saving your own money.
And it starts to break down these misnomers out there and makes people just kind of realize the basics of I have electronic equipment in my home, that electronic equipment needs electricity. I can either buy it at an expensive price from the utility or I can make it myself I'm gonna make it myself. Yeah. You know?
Ken Cook: Yeah.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: And then we can kinda build from there.
Ken Cook: Yeah, and pay off that little system you got at Home Depot or Costco in, uh, the course of maybe a year-
Bernadette Del Chiaro: Exactly ...
Ken Cook: depending on your rates. Yeah. Now, there is one problem that our president has identified, which is it turns out, I guess it's the rotation of the Earth, I don't really know how, uh, how it comes about, but there are periods during a 24-hour interval where it's dark. And of course- Yeah ... the, it doesn't, doesn't work in the dark. You know, you, you got- you know, the windmills in the sun. It, I mean, so batteries.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: That's right.
Ken Cook: Batteries. That's
Bernadette Del Chiaro: right.
Ken Cook: We have figured that out too. How crazy. So you, you could add that to the system. I mean, there's lots of different ways to piece this together. That's right. A whole different energy economy is available to us if we didn't have these dumb policies interfering.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: That's right. So we need to be able to, like, walk and chew gum when it comes to electricity. We need to understand that there are technologies like solar that generate electricity at times when we need it most, and generating electricity on hot summer days at 2:00 in the afternoon is when California needs it most. That's when we tend to have our greatest shortages. That drives up prices. That causes grid instability. We need more of just that.
We just need more plain solar, and if it's local, if it's on a balcony or on a roof, it dramatically cuts down on- Yeah ... the need to build more expensive and more prone to climate change, like our, you know, wildfires, grid infrastructure.
Now, the utilities don't like that because that's how they make money, but we should like it as consumers and as community leaders to build our energy resources down, tucked in in our neighborhoods 'cause it is safer and more affordable for all of us to do it that way. So first off, we need to generate electrons, and the best way to do that is to generate them from the sun because that's when we need them most.
But to your point, yeah, we wanna make the sun shine at night too, and we have that technology now in the form of batteries. These batteries work incredibly well. Distributed batteries hanging on garage walls all throughout California actually today, and we're only getting started, make up the largest battery in the world. So we've already broken through on that. Yeah, yeah. This, again, isn't something we need to kinda question, and you can smooth out that demand and load.
And the bigger the solar system, the bigger the battery. The more batteries we place in our communities, think about all the utility boxes that are in your neighborhood and in your community
Ken Cook: Yeah, put a battery there.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: Put a battery- Yeah ... there, and you could absorb all of whatever the home isn't using or the apartment isn't using, and make it available to everybody else in the community in the evening. It's pretty simple, pretty straightforward, but again, the politics are such that the utilities have a real stranglehold on Sacramento, and they just wanna- Yeah do everything that allows them to build a bigger and bigger grid, 'cause they get guaranteed profit.
And until we change that or until we have politicians that are brave enough to just say, "No, it's not a blank check," you know, "Rate payers are not an ATM machine. They are not captured subscribers of yours. We are gonna do things differently," until we have politicians that are brave enough to do that, we're gonna continue to have this political pushback.
Ken Cook: Well, let's hope that the balcony solar bill, when it gets signed into law here in Californias it's been signed in many other states already just this year, let's hope that that is just one more factor that tilts us toward sane electricity policy in California and elsewhere.
So thank you for your great work, and I know it was a lot of effort to get this past the legislature and to Governor Newsom's desk, and knock on wood, he's gonna sign it in the next 20 days, and we'll go to the next level to make sure California has clean energy. We need it.
Bernadette Del Chiaro: Onward and upward. Thank you, Ken.
Ken Cook: Thank you so much for listening. If you'd like to learn more, be sure to check out our show notes for additional links to take a deeper dive into today's discussion. Make sure to follow our show on Instagram at KenCooksPodcast. And if you're interested in learning more about EWG, head on over to ewg.org or check out the EWG Instagram account at Environmental Working Group.
Now, if this episode resonated with you or you think someone you know would benefit from it, please send it along. The best way to make positive change is to start as a community with your community. Today's episode was produced by the extraordinary Beth Rowe and Mary Kelly. Our show's theme music is by Moby. Thank you, Moby, and thanks again to all of you for listening.